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woodentop
Senior Smokie


woodentop

404 Posts
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Posted - 21 May 2016 :  11:58:46 AM Show ProfileSend woodentop a Private Message Reply with Quote
How about that for a non-controversial thread topic?

Anyway if you have 3 minutes and 21 seconds you might want to take a look at this.

Brexit - the animated movie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0pwXLtvt2w
Pensioner busybody
Wee Smokie


United Kingdom
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Posted - 23 May 2016 :  11:24:11 PM Show ProfileSend Pensioner busybody a Private Message Reply with Quote
Brexit: The Movie is also worth a watch, although it's over an hour long. Learnt a few things I didn't know.
woodentop
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woodentop

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Posted - 24 May 2016 :  9:28:19 PM Show ProfileSend woodentop a Private Message Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Pensioner busybody

Brexit: The Movie is also worth a watch, although it's over an hour long. Learnt a few things I didn't know.



Very true PB: the film can be found here:

https://www.brexitthemovie.com/
Derek
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Arbroath, Scotland
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Posted - 26 May 2016 :  12:32:19 PM Show ProfileSend Derek a Private Message Reply with Quote
The government are backing a fear based strategy again for this referendum, the same as the last one.
woodentop
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woodentop

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Posted - 26 May 2016 :  6:18:12 PM Show ProfileSend woodentop a Private Message Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Derek

The government are backing a fear based strategy again for this referendum, the same as the last one.



There's nothing positive to say about staying other than fear of what might happen if we come out. People should be just as concerned about what will happen to us if we stay in! There's no status quo in this, and I'd rather the country was in charge of its own fortunes rather than being subject to someone else's.
Terrymac
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Terrymac

United Kingdom
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Posted - 28 May 2016 :  8:19:39 PM Show Profile Visit Terrymac's HomepageSend Terrymac a Private Message Reply with Quote
I disagree totally.. Brexit has some high profile right wingers with much different views from the majority of the populace as regards actually living and working.. Farage from UKIP (who left the Conservatives because they were not right wing enough).. Boris Johnston the Clown who lives as he was born with scant regard for the general population.. Ian Duncan Smith who worked like hell to destroy the benefit system and castigate the poorest and disabled in society.. They just stir up feelings of disgust against a system that is slowly getting better.. The EU!! (it is still far from being perfect)

HERE ARE THE SIX BIGGEST UPSIDES TO CARRYING ON AS WE ARE IN EUROPE: A MUST READ BEFORE YOU VOTE:

1. We’re much better off in the EU.. The overall gain to Britain is about six per cent of our gross domestic product. This is many times more than the nett amount we pay into the EU pot as a member. There would be less money in the UK if we stopped contributing to the EU as a member. NO EXTRA MONEY TO INVEST IN THE NHS!! IN FACT HARSHER AUSTERITY!!
2. Trade stops wars. It also makes us a lot richer – and 50 per cent of all our trade is with the EU. It’s hoped that finishing off the job of creating a truly single market could boost GDP by yet another seven per cent. Our trade deals are much stronger through the EU.
3. There are an estimated 3.5 million jobs in Britain which are linked, one way or another, to the UK’s trade with the rest of Europe. Manufacturing would be hit especially hard. If Britain left the EU, the foreign companies (which own most of Britain’s car factories, for example) would shift their business overnight.
4. The free movement of labour within the EU – and the huge labour immigration to Britain that has resulted – is at the heart of the EU debate. Plus, there’s a flipside to the immigration debate which doesn’t get talked about much.. 2 million Brits currently living in the EU who would be forced to return to their homeland if we left the EU and did not sign a trade deal. A sudden influx of returning Brits would pose a larger challenge to the UK than the current immigration problem.
However, the most likely result would be that the free movement of labour would still be at the heart of any agreements to trade with the EU after “BREXIT” destroying the claims of “controlling our own borders.”
Also UK Immigration Control would be moved from France to the UK mainland.. We would have to deal with all global immigrants at our ports, train stations and airports and house all Immigrants claiming asylum while we dealt with their requests (Currently taking a minimum of two years) as we conform to International Law (Not EU).
5. The UK government, along with Labour, are totally against joining an EU run army and defence force that is formed by Brussels.. The UK is currently dedicated to working with NATO.. No matter what is agreed they cannot force the UK to become part of this.
6. Leaving Britain would be catastrophic for wine-drinkers.. Here’s the real killer, the cost of a bottle of plonk is going to sky-rocket. Seriously though, all imports would be hit because the UK’s existing trade deals were all made via the EU at the World Trade Organisation. It would take many, many years to set up trade deals worldwide.. Also, these deals would not be as equitable as the deals the EU already has. The general population would be worse off.

The majority of the population shall suffer on BREXIT.. Especially Scotland.


Terrymac
I have only one voice but I still strive to make a difference.
woodentop
Senior Smokie


woodentop

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Posted - 29 May 2016 :  02:24:54 AM Show ProfileSend woodentop a Private Message Reply with Quote
Oh dear Terry. Don't you like living in a democracy where you can get rid of the idiots in charge?

1. That's a guess. We'd not stop trading with the EU on Brexit. Ford recently moved production from the UK to Turkey, so EU membership hasn't helped there.

2. See 1.

3. See 1.

4. Incoherent point. I doubt eg Spain would be in a hurry to repatriate pensioners who spend a lot of money there. And it suggests no-one ever retired abroad before the EU. Or to Florida.

5. Give it time.

6. Really!?

Pensioner busybody
Wee Smokie


United Kingdom
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Posted - 30 May 2016 :  11:35:04 PM Show ProfileSend Pensioner busybody a Private Message Reply with Quote
Eh Terry. I thought you were a clever laddie. Oh deary me.
woodentop
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woodentop

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Posted - 31 May 2016 :  9:47:46 PM Show ProfileSend woodentop a Private Message Reply with Quote
Another day, another voice:

"This is more important than politics"...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFt-pRIvL9E&feature=youtu.be
Terrymac
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Terrymac

United Kingdom
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Posted - 01 Jun 2016 :  5:25:01 PM Show Profile Visit Terrymac's HomepageSend Terrymac a Private Message Reply with Quote
When 90% of Global Independent Financial Institutions and Departments indicate the massive loss in earning and employment within the UK upon a Brexit decision they are not guessing, they are basing their findings on their much valued experience.

I make no apologies for being a supporter of staying within the EU. In my opinion it is the best thing for the UK and especially Scotland, hence my post offering a truer view of what shall happen against the speculation of Brexit propaganda.




Terrymac
I have only one voice but I still strive to make a difference.
Terrymac
Master Smokie


Terrymac

United Kingdom
2440 Posts
Last here:
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Posted - 01 Jun 2016 :  6:08:32 PM Show Profile Visit Terrymac's HomepageSend Terrymac a Private Message Reply with Quote
Immigration and border control are increasingly cited as the main reasons for why the UK should leave the EU. Those advocating exit often mention Norway and Switzerland as models the UK should follow outside the EU. However, this briefing shows that Switzerland and Norway have far higher levels of EU immigration than the UK as a proportion of their populations. If the UK had the same net EU immigration rate as Switzerland, it would mean nearly 400,000 more EU migrants a year.

If you are not an EU member, as Norway, the UK must fully integrate into the EU’s free movement rules, and the EU has repeatedly made it clear that free movement of labour/people is the price that must be paid for access to the single market.

Another Brexit myth of reclaiming UK borders!!


Terrymac
I have only one voice but I still strive to make a difference.
woodentop
Senior Smokie


woodentop

404 Posts
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Posted - 01 Jun 2016 :  6:50:55 PM Show ProfileSend woodentop a Private Message Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Terrymac

When 90% of Global Independent Financial Institutions and Departments indicate the massive loss in earning and employment within the UK upon a Brexit decision they are not guessing, they are basing their findings on their much valued experience.

I make no apologies for being a supporter of staying within the EU. In my opinion it is the best thing for the UK and especially Scotland, hence my post offering a truer view of what shall happen against the speculation of Brexit propaganda.






I think you'll find lots of those "independent financial institutions either take money from the EU or benefit from the current setup (eg cheap labour).

Would leaving the EU exclude Britain from the Single Market?

The EU and the Single Market are not the same thing. Norway, Iceland and Liechtenstein are
members of the Single Market but not the EU. The EU has 28 member states, the Single Market
has 31. We do not need to be in either the EU or the Single Market in order to trade
with member states. Some in the Remain campaign argue that we cannot trade with the
Single Market without open borders and the free movement of EU citizens. That is simply not
true. Many countries trade with the EU without finding it necessary to join the EU or the Single
Market.

The top ten exporters to the EU are: China, Russia, USA, Switzerland, Norway, Japan,
Turkey, India, South Korea, and Brazil. Nine of these countries are not members of the
Single Market and six of them do not even have free-trade deals with the EU (China, Russia,
USA, Japan, India and Brazil). The fact that they are not members of the EU does not restrict
their trade; in fact it empowers them to trade on their own terms. Outside the EU, Britain could
negotiate a trade deal with the EU from a position of strength.

******************************************************************************************

Some say that if we leave the EU, we would be like Norway and Switzerland,
who have to obey most EU laws, pay a contribution to the EU budget, and have
open borders. Is this true?

No it is not. When Britain leaves the EU, it will not be obliged to follow either the so-called
‘Norwegian’ model or the ‘Swiss’ model. The Norwegians chose to be members of the
European Economic Area. Switzerland had agreed over 100 bilateral treaties with the EU,
which means it has adopted most EU laws without being a member of the EEA or EU.
No genuine advocate of Brexit would suggest this outcome is desirable.

Instead, we could adopt the ‘Canadian’, ‘Japanese’ or ‘Singaporean’ models: independent nation states that trade and
co-operate without being members of the EU. In reality we want a British Model which would
mean we do not have to obey EU laws, pay them any money or have open borders. We would
be in a very strong position to negotiate our own trade deal with the EU – and indeed trade
deals with the rest of the world. We would not have to join the EEA – and nor should we.

It is noteworthy that the Swiss Parliament recently voted to withdraw its 24 year-old
application to join the EU, because the costs of EU membership are too high. In 2006 the Swiss
Federal Government carried out a study that calculated that full membership of the EU would
cost up to six times the cost of their existing bilateral arrangements with the EU.

More FAQs here:

http://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/ukipdev/mailings/394/attachments/original/EU_Referendum_FAQ_v4.pdf?1463558115
Pensioner busybody
Wee Smokie


United Kingdom
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Posted - 01 Jun 2016 :  10:56:23 PM Show ProfileSend Pensioner busybody a Private Message Reply with Quote
Any of the above does not matter to this 'voter'. The word voter is what matters to me. We can't vote within the EU for anyone with influence because they are appointed, not voted for, are accountable to no one, and I have no idea who they are. Therefore, we cannot 'vote' them out if we don't like what they impose upon us. Even in Russia, they all know who their leader is. With our own government, we can kick them out if they go too far, as they always do eventually. That's all.
woodentop
Senior Smokie


woodentop

404 Posts
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Posted - 01 Jun 2016 :  11:09:49 PM Show ProfileSend woodentop a Private Message Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Pensioner busybody

Any of the above does not matter to this 'voter'. The word voter is what matters to me. We can't vote within the EU for anyone with influence because they are appointed, not voted for, are accountable to no one, and I have no idea who they are. Therefore, we cannot 'vote' them out if we don't like what they impose upon us. Even in Russia, they all know who their leader is. With our own government, we can kick them out if they go too far, as they always do eventually. That's all.



Agreed - and that's why our national parties are so "samey" these days (while pretending they're all at each other's throats)... there's very little left of substance that they're allowed to play with.

It gets worse next year when Qualified Majority Voting fully kicks in across the EU (ie the UK loses its veto).
woodentop
Senior Smokie


woodentop

404 Posts
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Posted - 05 Jun 2016 :  6:51:39 PM Show ProfileSend woodentop a Private Message Reply with Quote
I wonder if this is Brexit propaganda?

From the Daily Telegraph:

Britain asked for more cash as migrant crisis strains EU budget

With the bills piling up - but mindful that UK contributions to the EU are a hot topic in Britain’s EU membership referendum - MEPs' hearings on drawing up a draft budget for 2017 were postponed until the end of the month.

A vote on the seven-year budget has also been delayed.

Critics say the move was designed to avoid giving ammunition to Brexit campaigners who have made the cost of Britain’s EU membership a key plank of their campaign, arguing the money would be better spent directly on the NHS and UK schools.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/04/britain-asked-for-more-cash-as-migrant-crisis-strains-eu-budget/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
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